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	<title>Comments on: Chain mail (email, not armour)</title>
	<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2006/04/28/chain-mail-email-not-armour/</link>
	<description>hopping along the corridors of power</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 16:33:36 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: fastbike</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2006/04/28/chain-mail-email-not-armour/#comment-12331</link>
		<dc:creator>fastbike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 May 2006 00:08:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2006/04/28/chain-mail-email-not-armour/#comment-12331</guid>
		<description>I've just come across an &lt;a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/story/0,,1758298,00.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;article in Guardian Unlimited&lt;/a&gt;, which in my view, gives a better reason to avoid buying products from Mobil.  Of all the IOCs, they have been particularly active in funding and pedalling junk science to undermine any action to mitigate climate change.
&lt;blockquote&gt;
The document says the oil company Exxon Mobil has tried "to influence public opinion about the threat of climate change". It also says "concerted efforts" were made in 2004-05 to change the way the UK media covered climate science after Tony Blair declared that global warming was one of his priorities.&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve just come across an <a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/story/0,,1758298,00.html" >article in Guardian Unlimited</a>, which in my view, gives a better reason to avoid buying products from Mobil.  Of all the IOCs, they have been particularly active in funding and pedalling junk science to undermine any action to mitigate climate change.</p>
<blockquote><p>
The document says the oil company Exxon Mobil has tried &#8220;to influence public opinion about the threat of climate change&#8221;. It also says &#8220;concerted efforts&#8221; were made in 2004-05 to change the way the UK media covered climate science after Tony Blair declared that global warming was one of his priorities.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: Tomsk</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2006/04/28/chain-mail-email-not-armour/#comment-12256</link>
		<dc:creator>Tomsk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 May 2006 05:12:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2006/04/28/chain-mail-email-not-armour/#comment-12256</guid>
		<description>The email says: "Since we all rely on our cars, we can't just stop buying gas."

The funny thing is that (in Wellington at least) people have done just that, which is why buses and trains have had large increases in patronage. Of course, said buses and trains are now bursting at the seams because for years, various levels of government have refused to invest in public transport capacity. Why? Because "we all rely on our cars" of course!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The email says: &#8220;Since we all rely on our cars, we can&#8217;t just stop buying gas.&#8221;</p>
<p>The funny thing is that (in Wellington at least) people have done just that, which is why buses and trains have had large increases in patronage. Of course, said buses and trains are now bursting at the seams because for years, various levels of government have refused to invest in public transport capacity. Why? Because &#8220;we all rely on our cars&#8221; of course!</p>
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		<title>By: munter</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2006/04/28/chain-mail-email-not-armour/#comment-12254</link>
		<dc:creator>munter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 May 2006 22:31:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2006/04/28/chain-mail-email-not-armour/#comment-12254</guid>
		<description>i recently traveled to new plymouth from auckland
the cheapest you could get anywhere was mobil which was 7 cents cheaper than anywhere else</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i recently traveled to new plymouth from auckland<br />
the cheapest you could get anywhere was mobil which was 7 cents cheaper than anywhere else</p>
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		<title>By: DuncanK</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2006/04/28/chain-mail-email-not-armour/#comment-12234</link>
		<dc:creator>DuncanK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Apr 2006 05:24:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2006/04/28/chain-mail-email-not-armour/#comment-12234</guid>
		<description>I strongly urge readers to check out the Latest editorial at "The Oil Drum" about
"The Politics of Oil: The Discourse Must Change"
http://www.theoildrum.com/story/2006/4/26/121441/891

While it is directed at US politicians, we can all gain something from this insigtful commentary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I strongly urge readers to check out the Latest editorial at &#8220;The Oil Drum&#8221; about<br />
&#8220;The Politics of Oil: The Discourse Must Change&#8221;<br />
<a href="http://www.theoildrum.com/story/2006/4/26/121441/891" >http://www.theoildrum.com/story/2006/4/26/121441/891</a></p>
<p>While it is directed at US politicians, we can all gain something from this insigtful commentary.</p>
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		<title>By: fastbike</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2006/04/28/chain-mail-email-not-armour/#comment-12232</link>
		<dc:creator>fastbike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Apr 2006 01:43:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2006/04/28/chain-mail-email-not-armour/#comment-12232</guid>
		<description>As this email &lt;a href="http://www.env-econ.net/2006/04/can_consumers_f.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;originated in the US&lt;/a&gt;, and has merely changed the prices to reflect (historic) ;-) NZ levels, I thought it would be good to link back to The Oil Drum and &lt;a href="http://www.env-econ.net/2006/04/can_consumers_f_1.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;Environmental Economics&lt;/a&gt;, where the whole topic has been discussed in some detail.

Simple Answer = &lt;b&gt;DRIVE LESS&lt;/b&gt;

A boycott won't work.  What happens at all the other stations?  Assume Mobil has 20% market share and assume EVERYONE boycotts Mobil, that means demand at other retailers will increase by 20%.  When demand increases, prices rise.  So the effect of the boycott is to increase prices at all other outlets...Bugger !

Lucky Old Mobil - their price hasn't increased so the boycott makes their price look cheap.  Of course, given the oligopoly that operates in NZ, Mobil would put their prices up somewhat and still benefit because not everyone will boycott them.

Of course petrol is petrol - so it doesn't matter where it comes from.  If Mobil had an excess and the other 3 majors had a shortage, Mobil would be busy filling the tanks of the others - and hence selling more at a higher price.

The only way consumers can force lower prices is through the market mechanisms of supply and demand.  As Jeanette said, we need to consume less.  I.e. use the car less, use a smaller car, use a more efficient car, etc etc.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As this email <a href="http://www.env-econ.net/2006/04/can_consumers_f.html" >originated in the US</a>, and has merely changed the prices to reflect (historic) <img src='http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> NZ levels, I thought it would be good to link back to The Oil Drum and <a href="http://www.env-econ.net/2006/04/can_consumers_f_1.html" >Environmental Economics</a>, where the whole topic has been discussed in some detail.</p>
<p>Simple Answer = <b>DRIVE LESS</b></p>
<p>A boycott won&#8217;t work.  What happens at all the other stations?  Assume Mobil has 20% market share and assume EVERYONE boycotts Mobil, that means demand at other retailers will increase by 20%.  When demand increases, prices rise.  So the effect of the boycott is to increase prices at all other outlets&#8230;Bugger !</p>
<p>Lucky Old Mobil - their price hasn&#8217;t increased so the boycott makes their price look cheap.  Of course, given the oligopoly that operates in NZ, Mobil would put their prices up somewhat and still benefit because not everyone will boycott them.</p>
<p>Of course petrol is petrol - so it doesn&#8217;t matter where it comes from.  If Mobil had an excess and the other 3 majors had a shortage, Mobil would be busy filling the tanks of the others - and hence selling more at a higher price.</p>
<p>The only way consumers can force lower prices is through the market mechanisms of supply and demand.  As Jeanette said, we need to consume less.  I.e. use the car less, use a smaller car, use a more efficient car, etc etc.</p>
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		<title>By: Huskynut</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2006/04/28/chain-mail-email-not-armour/#comment-12230</link>
		<dc:creator>Huskynut</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Apr 2006 23:56:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2006/04/28/chain-mail-email-not-armour/#comment-12230</guid>
		<description>Jeanette is right about the root problem, but the profiteering is a problem in itself..  consumers are way too passive in the face of profiteering, I have no problem with encouraging them to attempt to take back what little power they can.  It might even flow through into a more active involvement in politics..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeanette is right about the root problem, but the profiteering is a problem in itself..  consumers are way too passive in the face of profiteering, I have no problem with encouraging them to attempt to take back what little power they can.  It might even flow through into a more active involvement in politics..</p>
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