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	<title>Comments on: A rough beast slouching towards Wellington?</title>
	<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/</link>
	<description>hopping along the corridors of power</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 11:48:49 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Kevyn</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31963</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevyn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Oct 2007 12:13:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31963</guid>
		<description>samiuela, yes, well, I think I prefer Einsteins relativity over philosophy's relativism :roll:.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>samiuela, yes, well, I think I prefer Einsteins relativity over philosophy&#8217;s relativism :roll:.</p>
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		<title>By: merlinnz</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31921</link>
		<dc:creator>merlinnz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:59:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31921</guid>
		<description>The issue of boys laggin behind girls has been addressed, effectively or not, since it ws first discovered. I chuckle when I consider how long it took to;

a) notice a lagging behind in girls; and then
b) to try to changeit

As a society, people may dislike what you describe as "extreme feminist lesbian element " but it was these people, men and women, who stood up and demanded girls get a better educational deal that now means that as soon as a disparity in boys was noticed, it was addressed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The issue of boys laggin behind girls has been addressed, effectively or not, since it ws first discovered. I chuckle when I consider how long it took to;</p>
<p>a) notice a lagging behind in girls; and then<br />
b) to try to changeit</p>
<p>As a society, people may dislike what you describe as &#8220;extreme feminist lesbian element &#8221; but it was these people, men and women, who stood up and demanded girls get a better educational deal that now means that as soon as a disparity in boys was noticed, it was addressed.</p>
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		<title>By: merlinnz</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31920</link>
		<dc:creator>merlinnz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:51:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31920</guid>
		<description>big bro

The poll I was asking you about was not the anti smacking legislation but the topic you referred to , legalising marijuana, it was that you said the vast majority of NZers are against. So, can you point me to that poll?

If you don't mind me asking, how old are you? I wonder because your impression of teaching "extreme feminist lesbian element" reminds me of the reaction many people had during the late 70's and early 80's.

If you pay peanuts you get monkeys. Until we indicate we value teaching through how much we pay people to do it, we will attract lower end people (whatever that might mean to you all) and have our hopes left with those who care about the job not the money. 

Big Bro, how many people do you know working at a job for low wages just because they have a passion for it? It's no wonder the real Estate industry is full of ex-teachers, the pay is better, the hours are better and there are no parents back seat driving.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>big bro</p>
<p>The poll I was asking you about was not the anti smacking legislation but the topic you referred to , legalising marijuana, it was that you said the vast majority of NZers are against. So, can you point me to that poll?</p>
<p>If you don&#8217;t mind me asking, how old are you? I wonder because your impression of teaching &#8220;extreme feminist lesbian element&#8221; reminds me of the reaction many people had during the late 70&#8217;s and early 80&#8217;s.</p>
<p>If you pay peanuts you get monkeys. Until we indicate we value teaching through how much we pay people to do it, we will attract lower end people (whatever that might mean to you all) and have our hopes left with those who care about the job not the money. </p>
<p>Big Bro, how many people do you know working at a job for low wages just because they have a passion for it? It&#8217;s no wonder the real Estate industry is full of ex-teachers, the pay is better, the hours are better and there are no parents back seat driving.</p>
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		<title>By: samiuela</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31913</link>
		<dc:creator>samiuela</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:12:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31913</guid>
		<description>Kevyn,

Many of my teachers were taught to think relativistically (some at high school, most at university). I suspect we are talking about different types of relativity :-)

Anyhow, I reckon that people place too much emphasis on the role of teachers (I'm not trying to minimise the role of teachers). I would like to see concrete examples of the "watered down, relativistic" teaching people are talking about ... all the teachers I know seem to be good teachers, not much different than the teachers I had 20+ years ago. Parents, family etc also have a huge influence on kids. Finally, as the kids get older, they also have to take responsibility for their own learning ... they can't expect to be spoon fed forever.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kevyn,</p>
<p>Many of my teachers were taught to think relativistically (some at high school, most at university). I suspect we are talking about different types of relativity <img src='http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Anyhow, I reckon that people place too much emphasis on the role of teachers (I&#8217;m not trying to minimise the role of teachers). I would like to see concrete examples of the &#8220;watered down, relativistic&#8221; teaching people are talking about &#8230; all the teachers I know seem to be good teachers, not much different than the teachers I had 20+ years ago. Parents, family etc also have a huge influence on kids. Finally, as the kids get older, they also have to take responsibility for their own learning &#8230; they can&#8217;t expect to be spoon fed forever.</p>
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		<title>By: phil u</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31909</link>
		<dc:creator>phil u</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:55:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31909</guid>
		<description>and..a 'ggod try' there..!..to try and define/control the debate away from the subject..(med-pot)..

..by use of an ad hominem..

(but it has 'back-fired' a wee bit..eh..?)

phil(whoar.co.nz)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>and..a &#8216;ggod try&#8217; there..!..to try and define/control the debate away from the subject..(med-pot)..</p>
<p>..by use of an ad hominem..</p>
<p>(but it has &#8216;back-fired&#8217; a wee bit..eh..?)</p>
<p>phil(whoar.co.nz)</p>
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		<title>By: phil u</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31908</link>
		<dc:creator>phil u</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:52:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31908</guid>
		<description>and gee..!

you need to have a heart-to-heart with your male co-leader..eh..?

(cos'..as you know..the 'meat' of this bill is but an echo of his (published in this forum) wishlist for any such legislation..

eh..?..)

(i would...but he dosen't answer me..eh..?..)

phil(whoar.co.nz)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>and gee..!</p>
<p>you need to have a heart-to-heart with your male co-leader..eh..?</p>
<p>(cos&#8217;..as you know..the &#8216;meat&#8217; of this bill is but an echo of his (published in this forum) wishlist for any such legislation..</p>
<p>eh..?..)</p>
<p>(i would&#8230;but he dosen&#8217;t answer me..eh..?..)</p>
<p>phil(whoar.co.nz)</p>
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		<title>By: phil u</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31907</link>
		<dc:creator>phil u</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:47:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31907</guid>
		<description>toad said..

"..For the record, from what I’ve read about it, I share many of the concerns that have been expressed by you and others on this blog about it..."

and..the 'yours' was a generic green one..

and can i ask what you are doing about/to fight this bill..?

phil(whoar.co.nz)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>toad said..</p>
<p>&#8220;..For the record, from what I’ve read about it, I share many of the concerns that have been expressed by you and others on this blog about it&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>and..the &#8216;yours&#8217; was a generic green one..</p>
<p>and can i ask what you are doing about/to fight this bill..?</p>
<p>phil(whoar.co.nz)</p>
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		<title>By: toad</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31906</link>
		<dc:creator>toad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:40:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31906</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;My&lt;/b&gt; electoral reform bill too now Phil?

Hell, I haven't even read the bloody thing, let alone had any role in developing it.  For the record, from what I've read about it, I share many of the concerns that have been expressed by you and others on this blog about it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>My</b> electoral reform bill too now Phil?</p>
<p>Hell, I haven&#8217;t even read the bloody thing, let alone had any role in developing it.  For the record, from what I&#8217;ve read about it, I share many of the concerns that have been expressed by you and others on this blog about it.</p>
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		<title>By: phil u</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31905</link>
		<dc:creator>phil u</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Oct 2007 18:55:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31905</guid>
		<description>and hey toad..!..

just in case you hadn't noticed..i also think your electoral reform bill..

is a poxy/repressive attack on our basic freedoms..

is this yet more evidence that john key ' has me by the short and curlies'..?

phil(whoar.co.nz)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>and hey toad..!..</p>
<p>just in case you hadn&#8217;t noticed..i also think your electoral reform bill..</p>
<p>is a poxy/repressive attack on our basic freedoms..</p>
<p>is this yet more evidence that john key &#8216; has me by the short and curlies&#8217;..?</p>
<p>phil(whoar.co.nz)</p>
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		<title>By: Kevyn</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31901</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevyn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Oct 2007 14:22:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2007/09/30/a-rough-beast-slouching-towards-wellington/#comment-31901</guid>
		<description>The real problem, as I see it, is that the teachers colleges have been captured by relativists who have taught teachers to teach relativistic "thinking". I don't know whether they did this because they thought it would stamp out discrimination or for some other reason but the upshot is they have created a generation that can't discriminate between right and wrong and for whom achieving concensus is more important than insisting on the best solution. And worst of all they are taught that the process of problemsolving is an end in itself rather merely the means to an end, that end being an effective, implemented solution.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The real problem, as I see it, is that the teachers colleges have been captured by relativists who have taught teachers to teach relativistic &#8220;thinking&#8221;. I don&#8217;t know whether they did this because they thought it would stamp out discrimination or for some other reason but the upshot is they have created a generation that can&#8217;t discriminate between right and wrong and for whom achieving concensus is more important than insisting on the best solution. And worst of all they are taught that the process of problemsolving is an end in itself rather merely the means to an end, that end being an effective, implemented solution.</p>
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